INTERVIEW OF SIFU ADAM HSU,
the founder of Traditional Wushu Association (a non profit organisation) in California, USA.
Conducted by Jean Paoli in December of 2002
In November of 2002, a group of journalists from martial arts magazines were invited to Taiwan by the Taiwan Tourist Bureau to better acquaint them with traditional wushu, a Chinese cultural treasure. A group of Taiwan kung fu Sifus, among them Adam Hsu, gave a presentation to the journalists, sharing their knowledge and expertise. This interview was conducted by one of the journalists, Jean Paoli from France’s Karate Bushido magazine. Contents of the interview first appeared in an article by Mr. Paoli that appeared in the March-April 2003 edition of the French publication, Wushu-Kung Fu.
I. For many years you have been promoting Chinese martial arts in America. What parts of this experience do you keep?
In America I learned how to teach. Of course my kung fu teaching began in Taiwan but the big difference there was my students were Chinese. They lived in a Chinese society, growing up with the same background and language, and somehow had some familiarity with Chinese kung fu. Kung fu is culturally foreign to American students.
I arrived in the U.S. too late. During the hippie era, when kung fu movies first became a hit in America, lots of people wanted to learn kung fu. By the time I moved there in 1978, it was much too late. Many people were already teaching and many misconceptions about kung fu had already taken root in the fertile American soil.
Six years ago, after an almost twenty year absence, I moved back to Taiwan. As I got to know the younger generation in Taiwan, I made a shocking discovery. Teaching these students turned out to be extremely difficult because they’ve lost their roots: their Eastern roots. Many young Asians are westernized, you could almost say Americanized. To pass down the art I needed to reach the younger generation, and then what a shock, what a culture shock, that was!
Today, western culture dominates the world. We Asians have willingly given up our roots. We wanted to learn from the West and we gained science and democracy. These are very very important. But then our whole lifestyle, way of thinking, and goals in life have also undergone major changes. Our educational system—from grammar to graduate school—is western. The way to prepare class, how to deliver your instruction, is all westernized. Anything that influences the educational system to this extent gets into the blood and changes the soul.
Western sports principles, training methods, ideas, habits, mental processes, and way of movement just will not work in Chinese kung fu. If you follow the western way, forgive me to say this, you can’t be good in kung fu.
I really believe in cultural exchange--bridging the Pacific has been my dream for a long time. Recent political events have created a volatile worldwide situation in which cultural respect, understanding and exchange is crucial for our planet’s healthy future. There are signs that awareness of this has grown but, I think, not enough. Many many people, especially Americans, believe that theirs is the only truth, the only way. I know this is much too big a picture and kung fu is, in contrast, much too small. But it’s my hope that if we really promote kung fu correctly, based on the cultural principles that saturate this art, it may help to open people’s eyes, widen their viewpoints, and ultimately contribute to peace in the world.
I feel lucky to have spent 20 years in the San Francisco Bay Area, such an open-minded region. I brought over some styles, techniques, and ideas. I taught, wrote articles and a book. But benefits flowed in two directions. I learned a great deal from my experiences in America.
II. The Bruce Lee phenomenon, the opening of mainland China, the Kung Fu culture in western countries, the reopening of the Shaolin Temple – seem to have put all traditional Chinese martial arts in the shadow. What is your opinion about this situation today, in the beginning of the 21st Century?
I feel let entertainment be entertainment. Enjoy the Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan movies, go see movies like Hero, nominated in the category of Best Foreign Film for both a Golden Globe award and an Oscar.
But all fantasy MUST be grounded in reality. The Shaolin Temple, Wudang Mountain, Omei Mountain—they are the fantasy. They’re famous, popular, respected by so many kung fu lovers, but, in fact, their revered reputations are all based on romantic martial arts fiction. They were never centers of real, traditional kung fu. Although entertainment and fantasy have helped to introduce and popularize kung fu, they have also caused damage to real martial arts by giving people false ideas and information about the true, traditional art.
As an example, the widely respected National Geographic Magazine and the Discovery Channel recently produced a special feature on the Shaolin Temple. Following on this, the Shaolin Temple applied to the United Nations for recognition as a human cultural asset—an award that would place them in the same lofty ranks, side by side, with true culture treasures such as the Kun Opera (Classical Chinese opera) and the ancient Buddhist temples of Japan.
Mainland China’s communist government must take a lot of the blame for the misinformation and misconceptions surrounding kung fu today. This topic is too big to be fully discussed in an interview like this so I can only sketch out what has gone on. In the late 20th century, the government systematically suppressed and reinvented, if you will, China’s native art forms. This was one of its methods to manipulate and control the people. For instance, during the Cultural Revolution, the government promoted a total of eight “politically correct” stage plays created specifically for propaganda purposes. For ten years, an entire decade, these eight were the only plays one hundred million people were allowed to see. Another tactic was creating a fictional person—a “sample” or “model” hero--with a long story line of obedience and sacrifice for Chinese children and citizens to emulate. The art of traditional wushu (kung fu) was suppressed and reinvented in the form of modern wushu, a performance art that fuses western and eastern influences. Today, the real art of kung fu is, in fact, suffering.
III. Taiwan seems to be a shelter for ancient traditions. What is the opinion in Taiwan concerning the admission of wushu to the Olympic games?
Regarding the development of wushu, promotion throughout the world, and the Olympics, the relationship of Taiwan to mainland China is like the tail to the doggy. When the doggy moves, the tail follows. For wushu, Taiwan follows the mainland, goes where it goes. The Taiwan government has never had the ability to establish and promote its programs outside of the country. Taiwan has martial arts but its community lacks unity, businessmen and leadership. You can’t get power unless you can band together towards the same goal.
IV. You have been to mainland China. What can you say about the martial arts situation in China today?
I think what the Chinese government is doing to kung fu is totally wrong. I am against it is because it is destroying the real kung fu. Again, this topic is way too big to cover in this interview—I can only give a thumbnail sketch here. But, for traditional Chinese martial arts, the situation is tragic. How to fix it? That’s a very difficult problem.
An additional factor, the people of China were very poor and for many years the country was completely cut off from the outside world. Individuals searching for a better life looked for any opportunity to move from their villages to the big, more prosperous cities, and hoped, ultimately, to leave the country. The “model” wushu program offers such opportunities for those who can compete and win. The gold medallists are rewarded with prestige and political positions in local government. They may also have opportunities to live and perform outside the country, perhaps even become movie stars. So there’s governmental control over its program, and the fact that large programs tend to guard and perpetuate their own existence, and then that governments do not want to admit and fix mistakes. And who dares to go against the government in a communist society?
V. You are considered the keeper of traditional wushu in many of kung fu’s major styles from the north and south of China. Bagua zhang, baji quan, pigua zhang, Chen taiji quan, and also mizong and tang lang – How do you plan for the transmission of these styles?
I never really studied southern styles so the information in this question is not totally accurate.
My way to promote and pass down the art is like this. I have a very weak point: I studied lots of styles. As I said before, it wasn’t because I had such a greedy appetite to devour many styles but because I couldn’t get what I wanted from one or two. Don’t get me wrong—this was not because the styles or masters I studied with were no good. I was young, still in high school. I had to prepare for college exams. I couldn’t spend enough time practicing. So fate led to my involvement with eight different styles—way too many. My suggestion to youngsters is always to focus on one style. OK, a student can have one or two on the side, but he should pick a major, one suitable to his mental and physical ability and interest.
These days, nobody has a lot of time. I believe the Japanese did a very good job 100 years ago. Realizing that martial arts can’t succeed against firearms, they divided their martial arts to kendo, karatedo, aikido, all the “do”s. Students studied only one “do.” So a really good karate practitioner doesn’t know how to use the saber. A judo champion doesn’t know how to deliver a punch. I feel that there’s nothing wrong with this.
In Japan some of the old style practitioners and masters I met are still dreaming they can do everything. They practice long spear, shoot the bow & arrow, do punching and kicking, learn take-down techniques, and of course wave their swords or knives, somehow just like Chinese martial arts. But that’s the minority group in Japan. The Japanese have it right: the majority of their martial artists devote themselves to one “do,” one style per person only. I see that as the future of Chinese martial arts. So that’s the reason I am against learning many styles. You are spread too thin and thus can’t do your martial arts well.
I want to turn my weakness into strength. My intention is to find the similarities in the different kung fu styles, not only those I practice but any I can lay my eyes on. I am looking for similarities in techniques, principles and usage among styles. Then, to state it clearly, my ambition is to try to build a Chinese kung fu constitution. We’ve never had one in all of kung fu’s history, and it’s badly needed to establish the basics of the true Chinese fighting arts, debunk the misconceptions, and relegate fantasy to the realm of entertainment, where it belongs.
I want to make it possible for traditional wushu to once again be pure, strong, and clear. I’ve been working on this for many years and will try to write it all down. This will not be a definitive Bible but the beginning step which, hopefully, the next generation will continue, standing on my shoulders to see further than I. It should take at least three generations to complete this project because kung fu, traditional wushu, isn’t like karate. The field is much too big, there are too many styles, and it’s impossible for one person to adequately research even a part of them. So like a relay race, the baton should be passed along from generation to generation. Thus the entire project can have a successful completion.
Then the best way for martial arts survival and development is, first, establish good programs in the educational system, PE classes starting in elementary school and continuing all the way through college.
Secondly, we need kung fu to succeed as a business. Business relates to economic concerns but also to serving people’s needs. Everyone needs to be healthy and live a long, happy life. This is not an area in which I have any talent but perhaps creative businessmen can find an honest way to successfully promote traditional kung fu. So in this new century, the business staff may be one of the most important “weapons” kung fu has on its side.
VI. Master, what are your exact official duties in the Taiwanese martial art community?
I don’t hold any position or shoulder any duties with government organizations and programs.
I don’t feel the preservation of traditional kung fu can be furthered through any existing governments or official programs.
When the martial arts reporters from France, England, Germany and America visited Taiwan (in 2002), our small group chose to create our own independent presentation, not to cooperate with any government bureau or kung fu organizations, because we were committed to sharing only the true, traditional art passed on to us through our training.
I myself am teaching, researching, and writing on my own. I’m very busy, and find it difficult, discouraging, and lonely. But this is my life’s work and so I will continue to struggle forward, inch by inch, step by step, and pass along what I have learned.
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